First impressions after playing the FS2013 demo

alexbnc
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First impressions after playing the FS2013 demo

Post by alexbnc » Sat Oct 20, 2012 6:40 pm

I don't know how much GIANTS takes our opinions and suggestions into account but they should know that the gaming industry it's not just selling my application, but also making the client enjoy it. So, after playing the demo a little bit, these are my first impressions, the good and bad ones:

*thumbsup* GOOD:
  • Improved performance, indeed. The game goes smooth on an average computer.
  • The map is definitely bigger than the FS2011 map, so it's a big world to explore.
  • The landscapes and ambient sound/light/effects make the place more pleasant. It's not just an almost empty terrain (just a tree here and there) like the FS2011 map.
  • I love the city, there's more life in it.
  • The audio part has been improved a lot. Very realistic sounds.
*thumbsdown* BAD:
  • I don't know if they even touched the game engine, I will compare the binary against the FS2011 to see if it's not the same. I mean, maybe it's a little more fast and maybe some improvements into the foliage's textures (and trees) were made. Anyway, I suppose the balance between quality and performance doesn't allow more than that. It's just that you may get confused sometimes and think that you are just playing FS2011, on a new map.
  • This one is important from me. I hate the "auto-steering" or whatever it's called this way of driving, when the wheels are automatically directed towards. What the heck? Where did you see that in real life. In real life, when you steer to the left, the wheels remain turned to the left, until you steer to the right. You really need to add a new option and allow users to enable/disable "steering auto-direct". You can also add a mouse steering option.
  • Absolutely no physics improvements, or at least, I don't feel anything new. At some point I had the impression that I was moving something on the screen, to the right, to the left, to the right, to the left (and the "auto-steering", "steering-correction" or whatever is called contributes to this sensation, too). I don't feel the weight of the vehicles. When you steer to the right or left, and especially at high speed, the vehicle must swing in the opposite direction a little bit (centrifugal force). I know, it's not a racing game, but I think the vehicles and their realism is the most important part of the game.
So, for know, this is my opinion, based on my preferences and short FS2013 experience playing the DEMO. I really hope they will publish a patch where an option to allow you disable that "auto-direction"(maybe someone can tell me the name for this driving mode). Also, take advantage of the nVidia PhysX technology and make me feel like I'm really driving a huge, heavy monster, not just slide it over the terrain. I hope I wasn't rude or rough and if someone else could share his/her opinion about the BAD/GOOD elements he saw in the DEMO, I gladly appreciate it.
Otherwise, I love the game and I am so anxious to try the full release, which maybe will remove the BAD list from here. Thanks!
Last edited by alexbnc on Tue Oct 23, 2012 3:11 pm, edited 2 times in total.

Lynx
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Re: First impressions after playing the FS2013 demo

Post by Lynx » Sat Oct 20, 2012 7:25 pm

I totally agree with you.

Personally i had hopes that when you drove in the crops, it would destroy them. Maybe track effects in the fields... which also accures in real world when spraying.
and like you said, more weight realism.
Maybe sliding with a tractor with trailer when driving in wet grass.... but....

richardsiegers
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Re: First impressions after playing the FS2013 demo

Post by richardsiegers » Sat Oct 20, 2012 9:28 pm

"This one is important from me. I hate the "auto-steering" or whatever it's called this way of driving, when the wheels are automatically directed towards. What the heck? Where did you see that in real life. In real life, when you steer to the left, the wheels remain turned to the left, until you steer to the right. You really need to add a new option and allow users to enable/disable "steering auto-direct". You can also add a mouse steering option."

What do you mean by this?

I just played the game to test was to were typing and it acts normal to me :confusednew:

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Rosenberg
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Re: First impressions after playing the FS2013 demo

Post by Rosenberg » Sat Oct 20, 2012 10:11 pm

"This one is important from me. I hate the "auto-steering" or whatever it's called this way of driving, when the wheels are automatically directed towards. What the heck? Where did you see that in real life. In real life, when you steer to the left, the wheels remain turned to the left, until you steer to the right. You really need to add a new option and allow users to enable/disable "steering auto-direct". You can also add a mouse steering option."
Well, it`s kinda halfway realistic. Because a tractor (or a car for that matter) will straighten up the wheels when at speed. Given that you have normal traction. It`s the laws of physics. I think it would be more unrealistic if you always had to steer the wheels back again. So i think Giant made the best of it, when they made it this way. :)

Reactivist
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Re: First impressions after playing the FS2013 demo

Post by Reactivist » Sat Oct 20, 2012 11:48 pm

Engine seems little changed, light switch still pauses the game momentarily, things like that, seems same physics, ie fast bouncey tractors that are not affected by terrain type or load being pulled etc etc
I like that the fields now have a different texture when cultivated etc as opposed to just a different colour, ploughing still has no use so its just cultivate, spray, seed and harvest, it seems the crops grow slower which is an improvment for me anyway, shadows seem to be slightly improved, nice village but with world of warcraft flashbacks.
Everything still shiny and the colours cartoony bright, tractors all remain brand new with no sign of any mud anywhere, the usual very clean and sanitised version of farming compared with reality, equipment still indestructible so no need to bother raising that cultivator, even when on concrete.
Hired hands seems a it better although they still miss some of the crop and do still get stuck on trees.

Its hard to judge on strength of the demo as the actual NEW features like new crops and animals etc dont seem to be accessable in it, so for those who have played the others, all they will really notice is a new map, as such Im left feeling "been there, done that", chances are the full game has new things that will keep those who played the others entertained enough and I may buy it.
I do wish they had revamped the basics though, made the game behave a bit more realistically.

alexbnc
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Re: First impressions after playing the FS2013 demo

Post by alexbnc » Sun Oct 21, 2012 1:25 pm

richardsiegers wrote:"This one is important from me. I hate the "auto-steering" or whatever it's called this way of driving, when the wheels are automatically directed towards. What the heck? Where did you see that in real life. In real life, when you steer to the left, the wheels remain turned to the left, until you steer to the right. You really need to add a new option and allow users to enable/disable "steering auto-direct". You can also add a mouse steering option."

What do you mean by this?

I just played the game to test was to were typing and it acts normal to me :confusednew:
No, the game is O.K. It's just a personal taste. I don't like this way of driving, in any driving game.

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NickelPlate
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Re: First impressions after playing the FS2013 demo

Post by NickelPlate » Sun Oct 21, 2012 3:34 pm

I'd say they most definitely have improved the engine. The grass view distance is now very far, where as with FS11 you could always see circle of grass drawing 100 feet or so in front of you as you drove around. I'm not sure about the crop view distance though as the demo only has one small pre-planted wheat field. Foliage density on the trees is improved and tree density is much higher. Also ground textures for bare ground are improved. Dirt textures now for seeding and plowing are much better than before. GPU usage seems lower or about the same as FS11 too which means they were able to make the engine more efficient. The machines driving feel about the same as in FS11. Also equipment draw distances seem improved which is nice when you're trying to see where your hired driver is on a field that's far way.

I'm disappointed that there are no ES limiters (at least on the demo tractors). These are desperately needed for keyboard users (the majority I'm certain) who want to easily match combine speed in a tractor/trailer when harvesting. You could get them on many modded tractors in FS11. I mean come on Giants if the modding community can do it, why can't you? Also when walking/running your man around the game world, the movement seems jerky. However when in a machine and driving around it's buttery smooth.

So far I'm really excited about it but my only other complaint is the demo is far too limited. Other than a single wheat field that you can harvest and one short tutorial of the potato harvester, there isn't alot to do except drive around the game world and see all the cool stuff you can't access like the store, pastures, etc.

trabo33
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Re: First impressions after playing the FS2013 demo

Post by trabo33 » Sun Oct 21, 2012 4:53 pm

I myself am a little annoyed at the way people are being so critical over a demo. Dont get me wrong, its ok to have an opinion and Im sure Giants likes the feedback which is what helps them improve and add features people have been wanting to see. I cant help but think if I was a programmer id be saying to myself right now, "wow what a tough bunch to please". There are some nice new features guys! Sure there are things that could be better in the realism department, but what makes a game series so popular is being able to release new ones year after year. I think over time Giants will tweak things more and more as the series grows. If they made one perfect game then what would we have to look forward to. I think FS 2013 will be awesome.

alexbnc
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Re: First impressions after playing the FS2013 demo

Post by alexbnc » Sun Oct 21, 2012 9:22 pm

trabo33 wrote:I myself am a little annoyed at the way people are being so critical over a demo. Dont get me wrong, its ok to have an opinion and Im sure Giants likes the feedback which is what helps them improve and add features people have been wanting to see. I cant help but think if I was a programmer id be saying to myself right now, "wow what a tough bunch to please". There are some nice new features guys! Sure there are things that could be better in the realism department, but what makes a game series so popular is being able to release new ones year after year. I think over time Giants will tweak things more and more as the series grows. If they made one perfect game then what would we have to look forward to. I think FS 2013 will be awesome.
I also pointed out the good things. I already bought the game, so the thinks that I didn't like IN THE DEMO, I repeat, are not listed here in order to make people not buy it, or make the developers feel like their work is not appreciated. They did a very good job and they must be prepared for criticism and everything. I am a modder anyway, so I will try to fill the deficiencies I see with the mods. I also saw that we will be able to download mods directly from the game application (no more, download, copy, move, etc.)

trabo33
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Re: First impressions after playing the FS2013 demo

Post by trabo33 » Sun Oct 21, 2012 10:02 pm

I wasn't aiming anything directly to you. I seen that you pointed out the good things. It wasn't anything on this forum that really got me but other forums. Since this is the best and only forum I'm registered to is why I posted on here. Some people are being to picky about tire tracks/dynamic terrain and better tractor physics. I agree all that would be really cool but some people are using those little things as the deciding factor on wheather or not the game is good. Some people say they aint gonna buy it because it's more like 2011 with a new map. To me thats just over the top to critical

Reactivist
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Re: First impressions after playing the FS2013 demo

Post by Reactivist » Mon Oct 22, 2012 12:06 pm

People have their own wishes and criteria about what makes a game good, one persons deal-breaker is anothers minor issue that doesnt affect their enjoyment.
There was a game some years ago called Tresspasser, a Jurassic park based first person shooter/exploring game which unlike ALL other first person shooters, you had to actually pick up the gun by controlling your hand and arm and then actually aim the gun controlling the hand and arm, this game got universally slated because of this quite cumbersome and difficult to master technique, but I loved it because it added an element of realism you dont get with a crosshair in the middle of the screen, its still the best ever game of this type in my oppinion.

For me with FS2013 I wanted a game that is the closest simulation of real farming, this is not saying that Giants have it wrong because its highly likely what people want is a very playable approximation that works well on most specs of computer.
I could be in a minority(and probably am) sitting here playing Agricultural simulator and wishing Giants had made it as they appear to be a much more professional company and it might not be such a bug riddled computer killer.

Stegei
GIANTS Software | CTO
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Re: First impressions after playing the FS2013 demo

Post by Stegei » Mon Oct 22, 2012 12:52 pm

We are absolutely happy to read constructive criticism. Unfortunately there are a lot of limitations around that prevent us from creating the "perfect" game. This already starts with the subjective definition of perfect and goes on with computer systems, budget, man power, etc.

E.g. the physics of the vehicles is a trade-off between realism and gameplay. If we would allow the tractors to tip slightly, it is very hard to prevent them from tipping them completely, which would totally be cumbersome gameplay-wise.

The lag when switch lights only happens for the very first time you play the game. With the new engine, all states are cached on your hard drive and are loaded when loading the game. However this cache needs to be created once because we can not pre-generate the states for all possible combinations of CPUs, GPUs and GPU driver versions.

alexbnc: Did you ever drive a real car/tractor? Once you release the steering wheel, it will automatically turn back to the original position. This also happen with Farming Simulator and other games with vehicles. The problem with the keyboard steering is that it's only digital. I.e. you can hold the steering at 50%. You should really try a steering wheel for the game. This totally improves the feeling.
Without the auto rotating back feature, it's almost unplayable. If you want to try out how this looks like, you can change the vehicle xml. The line looks something like this:
<wheels autoRotateBackSpeed="2">
Then change this to:
<wheels autoRotateBackSpeed="0">

Lynx
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Re: First impressions after playing the FS2013 demo

Post by Lynx » Mon Oct 22, 2012 12:59 pm

I will agree with you all.
But there is one thing you have to remember, when you start saying that we are too harsh with we critisize the new game.
And that is that we are the costumers, and Giant is the part selling the product.

We pay for the game, and they earn money on US! remmeber that ... they get paid, because we want to play their game.
That also means, that we can say whatever we like about the game, and they will have to listen to all people wishes, if they want to continue selling the product to us.

Whether they make changes or not, is up to them, but you can be sure that they are studying these forums, and discussing what to do, and from that they will improve the game, and change things.

So please dont tell us that we are to harsh, when we say what we want, people are difrent, and we have to accept eachothers wishes.

Giant is doing a great job on this game, and they are getting alot of help from the modders, because they made alot of nice vehicles and equipment to 2011, and that helped Giant see what could be improved to 2013. The game engine is running better, in 2011 you could change the view range of all equipment and crops, but then you could feel that it didnt run as smooth as it used to. Here in the 2013 demo, you can see alot further, without any lags, thats a huge improvement for me, because i like to play games with eyecandy, i like to wantch the tractors and the equipment from difrent angles when working it, so being able to see further than before, means alot to me.

My critic on the Tracks, well, it was based on some mods in 2011 which addes tire tracks on the ground when driving from a field to the road. and they had programmed the tires to accually cultivate the field when driving in them.
So when you where harvesting, or spraying, you would get 2 lines from where you have been. Thats what i was hoping giant had added, because then you have stopped all those who just drive trough all the fields to get to where they want--- because if they keep doing that, they simply dont earn money.

But thats just my oppinion.

Lynx.

alexbnc
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Re: First impressions after playing the FS2013 demo

Post by alexbnc » Mon Oct 22, 2012 10:13 pm

Stegei wrote:We are absolutely happy to read constructive criticism....
alexbnc: Did you ever drive a real car/tractor? Once you release the steering wheel, it will automatically turn back to the original position. This also happen with Farming Simulator and other games with vehicles. The problem with the keyboard steering is that it's only digital. I.e. you can hold the steering at 50%. You should really try a steering wheel for the game. This totally improves the feeling.
Without the auto rotating back feature, it's almost unplayable. If you want to try out how this looks like, you can change the vehicle xml. The line looks something like this:
<wheels autoRotateBackSpeed="2">
Then change this to:
<wheels autoRotateBackSpeed="0">
Thanks for your answer, Stegei! I think the game engine is almost the maximum you can achieve, keeping the best balance between performance and quality. This is the only game I have bought in my life, because I really like it and I really appreciate (as many of us do) the nice and hard work of your team. My impressions were based on my preferences, just after playing for not more than 1 hour, the DEMO. I am sure that the full version will really keep me captive for days and months, because there'll be so much in it (even hives, I have a lot of hives in my garden). Moreover, any personal taste can be fulfilled with the so easy to create MODS (I am a FS modder), which means an infinite number of implementations of any kind.
You should really try a steering wheel for the game. This totally improves the feeling.
It's on the way. No doubt the best experience is with a steering wheel. I'm gonna pull out my dad tractor's whell, see if it works with my PC, :lol:
PS.

:lol: Yes, I have driven everything except planes and space-ships. The tractors/cars I have driven don't do it like that (so quick) and not when you are stopped. Also, there's a little man inside the vehicles, holding the steering wheel, so he's the one who doesn't allow the auto rotating back (that's the name, thnks). I, at least, don't let the tractor drive by itself. Anyway, thanks for the little modding tip, I will change it to 1, that will be good for me.
So anxious, just 3 days left...

trabo33
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Re: First impressions after playing the FS2013 demo

Post by trabo33 » Tue Oct 23, 2012 12:31 am

I was never intending to offend anyone. I know everyone has and has the right to thier own opinion. Thats all I was doing was expressing my opinion. If the demo that was released is enough to decide wheather or not the game is worth buying or not to anyone then so be it. I was merely expressing my opinion. I can totally see everyones point of view.

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