170 Hours and It's Over

[farmerdonnie]

if really like a map more like 500 hrs

[Mobias]

Just catching up with this thread as I finally got round to getting FS22. Some of the criticisms of FS22 just aren't realistic, its always been the way with the game and Giants. People comparing it Rockstar and GTA or Microsoft/Asobo and Flight Simulator 2020 just aren't realistic at all. Both those games have literally thousands of the top people in the gaming industry working on them with 100 million dollar + budgets. Giants is a relatively small indie studio making a relatively small indie game with Farming Simulator. Its great to see it sell 3 million copies, its selling really well, but its still a relatively small production.

You have to accept it for it is and just except some of the limitations of it being what it is. Its never going to have a AAA production behind it. That being said I'm actually pretty impressed with FS22 so far playing on Calmsden Farm. The graphics are a bigger step up than what I was expecting. Lots of the small improvements have added up to it being a sum of its parts far more than FS19 ever was. I see some of the more clunky lighting effects have carried over from FS19 but over all the lighting is better.

The things that people want like more realistic physics and deformable terrain, which I'd love to see too, but these things are massively CPU intensive on a game which is already very heavy on the CPU. Its clear Giants were having to develop with the last gen consoles in mind and they've pushed things as far as they can for that hardware.

I suspect they probably don't need a whole new game engine. They just need to know they're developing for a higher minimum hardware spec. Be interesting to see what the next version is like but at least FS22 will keep me playing in the mean time, unlike FS19.

[GodfleshNL]

Giants game engine is a fossil and could use an upgrade. They made tons of money with Farming Simulator, so the excuse that it is a small team and other fanboy excuses are irrelivant.

My gues is that they are reluctant to change too much because they need modders to improve the game a lot.

Without mods the game would be boring as hell.

World of tanks started small too...go check out that gameengine now...it is amazing after a few years.

Giants rely too much on modders to make the game good...and they know it.

[punchi]

Always wonder why people come up with the engine?
Whats fossil about it? Does FS22 look like FS08? Obviously not, cause they are upgrading their engine all the time..but people just want to spread some random hate i guess.

On other games : OMG THEY DID SO MUCH IN WOLRD OF TANKS.
On FS22 : Nah they didnt do enough.

Also its just a assumption that everyone is playing with mods. Because on this forum everyone lives in this bubble. I think it was Giants or some kind of survey stating, that there are more people not using any mods at all, than people using mods.

[DEERE318]

Just catching up with this thread as I finally got round to getting FS22. Some of the criticisms of FS22 just aren't realistic, its always been the way with the game and Giants. People comparing it Rockstar and GTA or Microsoft/Asobo and Flight Simulator 2020 just aren't realistic at all. Both those games have literally thousands of the top people in the gaming industry working on them with 100 million dollar + budgets. Giants is a relatively small indie studio making a relatively small indie game with Farming Simulator. Its great to see it sell 3 million copies, its selling really well, but its still a relatively small production.

You have to accept it for it is and just except some of the limitations of it being what it is. Its never going to have a AAA production behind it. That being said I'm actually pretty impressed with FS22 so far playing on Calmsden Farm. The graphics are a bigger step up than what I was expecting. Lots of the small improvements have added up to it being a sum of its parts far more than FS19 ever was. I see some of the more clunky lighting effects have carried over from FS19 but over all the lighting is better.

The things that people want like more realistic physics and deformable terrain, which I'd love to see too, but these things are massively CPU intensive on a game which is already very heavy on the CPU. Its clear Giants were having to develop with the last gen consoles in mind and they've pushed things as far as they can for that hardware.

I suspect they probably don't need a whole new game engine. They just need to know they're developing for a higher minimum hardware spec. Be interesting to see what the next version is like but at least FS22 will keep me playing in the mean time, unlike FS19.

People always say don't compare FS to other games like GTA and such. Probably because those games are embarrassingly more advanced.
Just recently one of the fans compared FS22 to a game from 2007, because I guess it fit their needs. However, even that 2007 game is embarrassingly more advanced.
Claiming FS will never have AAA production is disappointing to those that pay a AAA price.

"I suspect they probably don't need a whole new game engine. They just need to know they're developing for a higher minimum hardware spec."
They struggle with the game logic itself, not completing functions, missing/ignoring glaring bugs that shouldn't be missed during reliable testing. I don't think their out of date engine is due to hardware specs, it's more likely out of date due to the technical knowledge and skill of the developers. That's not meant as an insult either, as it has often has been taken. It's a good argument for adopting a much more advanced third party engine, and tweak it as needed.

[DEERE318]

Always wonder why people come up with the engine?
Whats fossil about it? Does FS22 look like FS08? Obviously not, cause they are upgrading their engine all the time..but people just want to spread some random hate i guess.

On other games : OMG THEY DID SO MUCH IN WOLRD OF TANKS.
On FS22 : Nah they didnt do enough.

Also its just a assumption that everyone is playing with mods. Because on this forum everyone lives in this bubble. I think it was Giants or some kind of survey stating, that there are more people not using any mods at all, than people using mods.

Of course FS22 doesn't look like FS08. But, look at other games from 2008, and some of those still look better than FS22.

I think it was a certain modder that said that most people don't use mods. My guess is that most of the 3 million people who bought the game didn't play it beyond day one.

[mackintosh]

Always wonder why people come up with the engine?
Whats fossil about it? Does FS22 look like FS08? Obviously not, cause they are upgrading their engine all the time..but people just want to spread some random hate i guess.

It's not just about the visuals (which are mostly just some DX12 features tacked onto FS15 improvements). It's about its inability to take advantage of modern hardware. One of the reasons we can't have nice things (such as better physics) is because the engine simply doesn't have the ability to leverage any sort of parallelisation. Modern games are becoming multithreading aware, which allows for better use of system resources to do ever more complex things. FS22 is stagnant in that regard. We haven't seen much in terms of physics development since Ground Response was introduced as a mod in FS17.

[Buffzila]

Just catching up with this thread as I finally got round to getting FS22. Some of the criticisms of FS22 just aren't realistic, its always been the way with the game and Giants. People comparing it Rockstar and GTA or Microsoft/Asobo and Flight Simulator 2020 just aren't realistic at all. Both those games have literally thousands of the top people in the gaming industry working on them with 100 million dollar + budgets. Giants is a relatively small indie studio making a relatively small indie game with Farming Simulator. Its great to see it sell 3 million copies, its selling really well, but its still a relatively small production.

You have to accept it for it is and just except some of the limitations of it being what it is. Its never going to have a AAA production behind it. That being said I'm actually pretty impressed with FS22 so far playing on Calmsden Farm. The graphics are a bigger step up than what I was expecting. Lots of the small improvements have added up to it being a sum of its parts far more than FS19 ever was. I see some of the more clunky lighting effects have carried over from FS19 but over all the lighting is better.

The things that people want like more realistic physics and deformable terrain, which I'd love to see too, but these things are massively CPU intensive on a game which is already very heavy on the CPU. Its clear Giants were having to develop with the last gen consoles in mind and they've pushed things as far as they can for that hardware.

I suspect they probably don't need a whole new game engine. They just need to know they're developing for a higher minimum hardware spec. Be interesting to see what the next version is like but at least FS22 will keep me playing in the mean time, unlike FS19.

People always say don't compare FS to other games like GTA and such. Probably because those games are embarrassingly more advanced.
Just recently one of the fans compared FS22 to a game from 2007, because I guess it fit their needs. However, even that 2007 game is embarrassingly more advanced.
Claiming FS will never have AAA production is disappointing to those that pay a AAA price.

"I suspect they probably don't need a whole new game engine. They just need to know they're developing for a higher minimum hardware spec."
They struggle with the game logic itself, not completing functions, missing/ignoring glaring bugs that shouldn't be missed during reliable testing. I don't think their out of date engine is due to hardware specs, it's more likely out of date due to the technical knowledge and skill of the developers. That's not meant as an insult either, as it has often has been taken. It's a good argument for adopting a much more advanced third party engine, and tweak it as needed.

Why you, best of bests, dont go to GS and start working for company and show to all, how to make it better? Everyone have chance get work in GS and show us how to do it better than only flame hate here on forums or not?

[this_is_gav]

Let's say GIANTS did move over to a new engine - you can't simply use the engine as it is as it doesn't support the features needed for FS, so you'd have to adapt it, reintroducing features you've spent the last 20 years introducing already. You probably wouldn't have a new game for something like 6-10+ years as you'd need to learn the new engine, see what works, what doesn't and retrain all the development staff before even starting to actually make the game, by which point many players and modders would have abandoned FS and moved on.

You would have to continue adapting it to add yet more features to the point where it's no longer, for example, Unreal Engine anymore, yet you're still having to pay Epic the license fees but for a game where you can't just introduce new UE features because your code base is now presumably vastly different to the source code base. You'd be spending years and a lot of expense continually back tracking and realigning code, redoing the features again with updated code to move forward, and by then a new technology has been announced and you'd have to do it all again - all while paying Epic.

Then do the same for most of the modding tools, as they'd be different too.

It doesn't sound like an economical way to run a niche game developer.


It's not that GIANTS couldn't or wouldn't use another engine - I'm sure they've considered it - it's more that it would create a risk to the franchise and ultimately the safety of the jobs of their employees by not having the certainty of a new game every three or four years, and currently we're in a time of economical uncertainty already - not that I expect that GIANTS are in or have been at risk for some time, but surely you can see why they don't just wipe the slate clean and start again?

Just recently one of the fans compared FS22 to a game from 2007, because I guess it fit their needs. However, even that 2007 game is embarrassingly more advanced.

Talk about distorting arguments to fit their needs...

I'm hardly a GIANTS fanboy. I've been as critical of GIANTS as most as you know. I just try to bring rational thinking and realism into discussions rather than a sea of negativity.

[DEERE318]

Let's say GIANTS did move over to a new engine - you can't simply use the engine as it is as it doesn't support the features needed for FS, so you'd have to adapt it, reintroducing features you've spent the last 20 years introducing already. You probably wouldn't have a new game for something like 6-10+ years as you'd need to learn the new engine, see what works, what doesn't and retrain all the development staff before even starting to actually make the game, by which point many players and modders would have abandoned FS and moved on.

You would have to continue adapting it to add yet more features to the point where it's no longer, for example, Unreal Engine anymore, yet you're still having to pay Epic the license fees but for a game where you can't just introduce new UE features because your code base is now presumably vastly different to the source code base. You'd be spending years and a lot of expense continually back tracking and realigning code, redoing the features again with updated code to move forward, and by then a new technology has been announced and you'd have to do it all again - all while paying Epic.

Then do the same for most of the modding tools, as they'd be different too.

It doesn't sound like an economical way to run a niche game developer.


It's not that GIANTS couldn't or wouldn't use another engine - I'm sure they've considered it - it's more that it would create a risk to the franchise and ultimately the safety of the jobs of their employees by not having the certainty of a new game every three or four years, and currently we're in a time of economical uncertainty already - not that I expect that GIANTS are in or have been at risk for some time, but surely you can see why they don't just wipe the slate clean and start again?

Just recently one of the fans compared FS22 to a game from 2007, because I guess it fit their needs. However, even that 2007 game is embarrassingly more advanced.

Talk about distorting arguments to fit their needs...

I'm hardly a GIANTS fanboy. I've been as critical of GIANTS as most as you know. I just try to bring rational thinking and realism into discussions rather than a sea of negativity.

Note I said fan, not fanboy which is taken as a dig.
I am also a fan, despite what others believe.

[DEERE318]

Just catching up with this thread as I finally got round to getting FS22. Some of the criticisms of FS22 just aren't realistic, its always been the way with the game and Giants. People comparing it Rockstar and GTA or Microsoft/Asobo and Flight Simulator 2020 just aren't realistic at all. Both those games have literally thousands of the top people in the gaming industry working on them with 100 million dollar + budgets. Giants is a relatively small indie studio making a relatively small indie game with Farming Simulator. Its great to see it sell 3 million copies, its selling really well, but its still a relatively small production.

You have to accept it for it is and just except some of the limitations of it being what it is. Its never going to have a AAA production behind it. That being said I'm actually pretty impressed with FS22 so far playing on Calmsden Farm. The graphics are a bigger step up than what I was expecting. Lots of the small improvements have added up to it being a sum of its parts far more than FS19 ever was. I see some of the more clunky lighting effects have carried over from FS19 but over all the lighting is better.

The things that people want like more realistic physics and deformable terrain, which I'd love to see too, but these things are massively CPU intensive on a game which is already very heavy on the CPU. Its clear Giants were having to develop with the last gen consoles in mind and they've pushed things as far as they can for that hardware.

I suspect they probably don't need a whole new game engine. They just need to know they're developing for a higher minimum hardware spec. Be interesting to see what the next version is like but at least FS22 will keep me playing in the mean time, unlike FS19.

People always say don't compare FS to other games like GTA and such. Probably because those games are embarrassingly more advanced.
Just recently one of the fans compared FS22 to a game from 2007, because I guess it fit their needs. However, even that 2007 game is embarrassingly more advanced.
Claiming FS will never have AAA production is disappointing to those that pay a AAA price.

"I suspect they probably don't need a whole new game engine. They just need to know they're developing for a higher minimum hardware spec."
They struggle with the game logic itself, not completing functions, missing/ignoring glaring bugs that shouldn't be missed during reliable testing. I don't think their out of date engine is due to hardware specs, it's more likely out of date due to the technical knowledge and skill of the developers. That's not meant as an insult either, as it has often has been taken. It's a good argument for adopting a much more advanced third party engine, and tweak it as needed.

Why you, best of bests, dont go to GS and start working for company and show to all, how to make it better? Everyone have chance get work in GS and show us how to do it better than only flame hate here on forums or not?

Don't take it so personally.
Offering feedback doesn't mean I know how to do it better.

[Mwal]

All I know is someone better get giants under control because all this developing they’re doing without knowing anything about what they’re doing we’re sure to end up in some sort of I robot or terminator type situation.

[Luftkopf]

Sometimes I wonder whether half of the complaints about the engine are actually people not liking the Farm Sim art style. I personally don't mind it, but I can understand why others don't like it.

[DEERE318]

All I know is someone better get giants under control because all this developing they’re doing without knowing anything about what they’re doing we’re sure to end up in some sort of I robot or terminator type situation.

I think there's still a bit of a gap between hired helpers AI and the Terminator AI

[DEERE318]

Sometimes I wonder whether half of the complaints about the engine are actually people not liking the Farm Sim art style. I personally don't mind it, but I can understand why others don't like it.

Maybe you're right about a lot of complaints about the art style.
A lot are also related to performance, especially when you see what is possible, based on other unmentionable's.