fs17 revisited

[Cokey]

Illinois farmer, i put this topic on here just to see if people felt similar about the comparison, not about fs 17 per se

[BulletBill]

I think the differences between Fs17 and Fs19 do depend if your used to console or Pc.

On Console Fs17 had the flat default lighting which wasn't amazing, although it was balanced.
But on Pc we were able to adjust the lighting and make Fs17 a lot nicer.
For an example of what Fs17 can look like you can view any of my screenshots from my "The Western Shore" map. None of the pictures have any shaders on them at all.

I can understand a console player thinking "what the heck are they on about" as Fs17 default to Fs19 default on console looks much more advanced.

But for myself after spending 3.5 years improving Fs17 to the point me and my friends have got it now, Fs19 seems such a massive let down on PC.

As Gav has already said it seems like GIANTS focused entirely on the vehicles and equipment at the expense of the natural scenery and terrain textures.

Also for everyone hyping up the vehicle textures they aren't as good as they first seem. Often model parts like the wheel rims particularly will lose all depth and go flat at certain angles. Somebody explained to me it's because Fs19 no longer uses the older AO (Ambient Occlusion) Instead it uses SMAO which doesn't work as well, although apparently being more advanced.

Often so many Fs19 screenshots make the models textures look like something from Fs11...

It is so frustrating as Fs19 had the potential to be far better than it currently is.

Instead GIANTS seem to lack communication between departments, and seem to have stopped caring about how finished there product really is anymore. That trend has continued even with there DLCs.

[WON'T FIX] has become Fs19's biggest meme, which is just sad.

What I feel personally is I'm stuck in the middle.

Fs17 feels and looks dated, plus It misses some of the few good new features of Fs19.

But Fs19 is not balanced, and is missing so much of what made Fs17 great. In some cases it's gone backwards.

Neither game is good enough anymore.

What depresses me is I can't see Fs2X will be any better than Fs19... the most likely outcome is more of the same.

[norfolk farmer]

Give me 19 seasons functions on 17 and I'd happily uninstall 19.

[Hallers]

Must say I have a very deep respect for BulletBill after the maps he created on FS17. They are so creative and feels very alive. This goes for almost all the modders. For me as a console player FS19 have never given the good feeling like FS17 gave, even with all the new implements that FS 19 have. As the next game I just really hope that Giants listen too modders like BulletBill and other modders, so that the game can come back to it`s roots. FS is nothing without mods and the modders who make them, so If I were to given Giants an advice, I would advice them to make the game as mod-friendly as it can get. It`s the modders that make this game creative and fun for years.

[SJ_Sathanas]

I think the differences between Fs17 and Fs19 do depend if your used to console or Pc.

On Console Fs17 had the flat default lighting which wasn't amazing, although it was balanced.
But on Pc we were able to adjust the lighting and make Fs17 a lot nicer.
For an example of what Fs17 can look like you can view any of my screenshots from my "The Western Shore" map. None of the pictures have any shaders on them at all.

I can understand a console player thinking "what the heck are they on about" as Fs17 default to Fs19 default on console looks much more advanced.

But for myself after spending 3.5 years improving Fs17 to the point me and my friends have got it now, Fs19 seems such a massive let down on PC.

As Gav has already said it seems like GIANTS focused entirely on the vehicles and equipment at the expense of the natural scenery and terrain textures.

Also for everyone hyping up the vehicle textures they aren't as good as they first seem. Often model parts like the wheel rims particularly will lose all depth and go flat at certain angles. Somebody explained to me it's because Fs19 no longer uses the older AO (Ambient Occlusion) Instead it uses SMAO which doesn't work as well, although apparently being more advanced.

Often so many Fs19 screenshots make the models textures look like something from Fs11...

It is so frustrating as Fs19 had the potential to be far better than it currently is.

Instead GIANTS seem to lack communication between departments, and seem to have stopped caring about how finished there product really is anymore. That trend has continued even with there DLCs.

[WON'T FIX] has become Fs19's biggest meme, which is just sad.

What I feel personally is I'm stuck in the middle.

Fs17 feels and looks dated, plus It misses some of the few good new features of Fs19.

But Fs19 is not balanced, and is missing so much of what made Fs17 great. In some cases it's gone backwards.

Neither game is good enough anymore.

What depresses me is I can't see Fs2X will be any better than Fs19... the most likely outcome is more of the same.

I'm in the same position, though I've arrived at the same conclusion from the opposite direction (so to speak), being an FS19 console player who converted to a pc then discovered FS17.
Neither game really feels satisfying, as i miss the elements of one while I play the other, and I'm not particularly enthusiastic for FS21.

[Mobias]

What I feel personally is I'm stuck in the middle.

Fs17 feels and looks dated, plus It misses some of the few good new features of Fs19.

But Fs19 is not balanced, and is missing so much of what made Fs17 great. In some cases it's gone backwards.

Neither game is good enough anymore.

What depresses me is I can't see Fs2X will be any better than Fs19... the most likely outcome is more of the same.

Yeah that sums up how I feel too. When I go back and fire up FS-17 I miss some of the nice little features of FS-19 but when I play FS-19 I miss the over all look and feel of FS-17. It does seem to be a bit of a common feeling that people say they can't get as immersed in FS-19 as they did in FS-17 and I totally share that feeling. Its a weird limbo to be in with the game.

For FS-21 I'm worried Giants are going to continue throwing so much of their resources into the placables system. Its clear they did that with FS-19 and it sill doesn't work very well and it only seems to be they're in the first place to appease a minority of players, mainly on console. For the most part people prefer well made hand crafted really immersive maps made by all the best map makers out there. The whole 'build a farm' may sound good on paper but the reality is completely different, for a whole load of reasons that are well discussed.

I'd be happy for Giants to streamline FS and actually remove features if it meant other more important features could be improved. They should definitely add more detail to the existing features rather than keeping on adding more and more obscure content. The later of which I get the impression is only added in the first place to keep their marketing department happy.

[1992Tadej1992]

Yesterday i played fs19 again. I couldnt sleep that night and i am still having a headache because of obvious reasons.

[IceUul]

I think the problem is how maps looks in FS19, unnatural, unrealistic, ugly might be words to describe them, compared to FS17.
There are few maps that looks good still, but really a few.

So my wish for next FS game, please make the world more natural, more realistic.
For example, you can get the game SnowRunner, there are 3 different seasons already included and they look fantastic, most of the time
i enjoy the nature in this game, than gameplay itself.
Michigan for Autumn
Alaska for Winter
Taymyr for Summer

Go check out 4k videos inside youtube about gameplay on these maps, they look fantastic, really hope one day FS would look same natural.

[pingu]

Look and feel is something very subjective. To me, FS19 (at least in GIANTs marketing before the release) looked very nice and realistic. But when I see it myself on my own screen, it is like something totally different. And when I try to actually play the game, I have to turn down the settings so much that it looks like a 20 year old FPS. And that on the same machine that I can play FS17 with close to maxed out graphics. So that alone makes it unplayable... But even at very high graphics settings, FS19 feels like a cartoon with oversaturated colors. The objects (buildings, machinery, trees...) tend to live their own life all nice and shiny and in a way more 'realistic' than in FS17. But they don't blend together to form an environment. It is like they are separated objects disconnected from each other. A tractor in a field looks like a picture photoshopped into another picture. Looking at FS17, things blend together. A tractor on a field look like it is there. It may not be the same photorealism, but it is still better. To me, that is the look and feel I miss in FS19. And then the weird lighting and very unrealistic views out in the distance on a map. Just before I wrote this, I was in a tractor cutting grass on The Western Shore. The views out over the landscape with its valleys and farms is just amazing. Not just because the environemnt is realistic. Its also the light and haze and colors... I haven't seen any screeenshot from FS19 that come close. I'm looking at screenshots from Sand Bay for FS19 now. Excellent details. Nice texture on the roads. Buildings and machines looks very realistic. But the human and earthly warmth and feel isn't there to me. It feels like a fantasy landscape on another planet with a different composition of the atmosphere and a sun that is on another point on the Hertzsprung–Russell diagram. It's weird...

But this is as I mentioned my subjective opinion. Then there are the technical details about what changed in FS19. Stuff like those BulletBill mention. Even if I program, I do not mod and have no knowledge about it. But obviously something changed so that it still (1 1/2 years later) seems to be very hard to create a map in FS19 that have the look and feel of the best maps in FS17.

A short note about the build-your-farm thing that I really looked forward to but haven't experienced because I don't play FS19... Obviously a lot of criticism and disappointment about how it was implemented. I still think the idea is good. Maybe it is just implemented the wrong way. Other than that, FS19 still lacks all the realistic details I hoped for that makes running the farm (not just the machinery) more interesting and challenging and non-repetetive. But I guess brand names are more important to allure casual players...

[Mobias]

For example, you can get the game SnowRunner, there are 3 different seasons already included and they look fantastic, most of the time
i enjoy the nature in this game, than gameplay itself.
Michigan for Autumn
Alaska for Winter
Taymyr for Summer

Go check out 4k videos inside youtube about gameplay on these maps, they look fantastic, really hope one day FS would look same natural.

SnowRunner is the best example I can think of of where I'd like to see the look and feel and general art direction of FS go in the future. Everything about the way it looks should really be the goal of Giants.

It was interesting watching the Sony launch of the PS5 last night and seeing what thats console is going to be capable of. Obviously for the most part we were looking at AAA first party games but I don't think Giants will get away with releasing FS-19 all over again next year and expect it to last. They are going to have to up their game, in every sense of the word, with FS-21. If that means not releasing on the current gen consoles and hurting sales in the short term then so be it. Its a gamble they're going to have to take make pay off in the long run.

[SJ_Sathanas]

I find the generally empty skies of 19 reallydraw the eye to the horizon, where the real time world ends and the static background meet.

[BulletBill]

What I would like is a game that feels refined, polished, everything working and blending together.

For me my enjoyment of a game is how immersed I can get, if I start getting my attention drawn to stuff in a bad or negative way it just distracts from the overall enjoyment.

Farm Sim is by nature a more slow paced game compared to others. This means you notice the scenery far more around you as well as the vehicle and equipment models around you.

My hope is that GIANTS release Fs2X as a finished, polished product, one where they have taken there time to get a nice balance.

It's all good adding new crops, new brands etc, but those tend to get old pretty quickly.

I feel going back and making the whole experience of existing features more immersive would bring far more lasting enjoyment to players.

For example the vehicle physics and sounds, if those were really improved to feel realistic without being frustrating you would enjoy driving about far more.
MR showed in a way how that can be, even small things like the hydraulic linkage swaying back and forth as you travel.
TrailerSound Mod, which added a simple yet thoroughly enjoyable sound of a trailer clanking and rattling, or when on a road the tyre noise.
These little things when added together just make the experience nicer, fuller.

That is what Farm Sim needs, not another crop, or another brand.
It needs refinement of the existing feature.

[Hallers]

That is what Farm Sim needs, not another crop, or another brand.
It needs refinement of the existing feature.
[/quote]

This is spot on. We don`t need one more application to spray on the fields or another crop that is seeded and harvested with the same equipment as before. We need a polished game thats enjoyable to play for years.

[Lexie]

Was doing some contracts this week in FS19. So get some different Deeres and a Fendt with tracks, those tractors where hurting my ears and a lot of them do. I really can not understand why Giants thinks this is ok, it's do not even sounds like a tractor. My first FS game was 17, and I remember the first drives with the Case 1455 and NH 8340 on Goldcrest. It did remind me of the tractor sounds I heard when I was a little boy on holiday at the countryside

As mentioned by others, the backgrounds/map borders of FS19, those are hurting your eyes and take away all feeling of a real place.
The textures on 19 are better when you are close, but from a distance everything looks incorrect and unrealistic. It's looks like everything is made from plastic or something with all details gone.

[BulletBill]

The problem is, looking at it from GIANTS point of view, is Fs19 to them has been a success, financially at least with the highest level of sales of any Farm Sim game.

It might be a negative view, but they could quite easily say, we released a half finished product with tons of bugs, yet we made more money than ever. Let's do the same again.
Sadly money is probably the only thing that will make them do anything different.

If sales of Fs2X are poor, then maybe they might wake up and realise things need to change.
But if sales are good whats the incentive for them to change there current methods.