FS22 Multi Terrain Angle Update?

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Hoffa82
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Re: FS22 Multi Terrain Angle Update?

Post by Hoffa82 »

But if they put it in game I'm sure we'll get a thread about Giants stealing it from modders. *thumbsup*
Eische
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Re: FS22 Multi Terrain Angle Update?

Post by Eische »

There are multiple reasons, why they do not have multi terrain angles in the basegame. They were mentioned in the Q&A session of day 2 stream:
1. Their philosophy
Giants wants to offer same features to all platforms. Sure, if modders add new features only for PC they are fine with that. But the basegame should offer same experience to all players.

2. hardware restriction.
Especially the old consoles are not able to handle the increased memory demand of multi terrain angles.

3. visuals
They are not satisfied with the transition between the textures at different angles. Sure, at the moment they are bad, too.
As far as I understood it, once they find a way to implement it with much better transitions, they would give it a go.
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BulletBill
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Re: FS22 Multi Terrain Angle Update?

Post by BulletBill »

I did find it very disappointing that Stefan's answer was the same he gave me over 2 years ago at the beginning of Fs19.

As to the memory performance aspect he would know best on that, but when testing a map in Fs17 with and without MTA via the resource monitor ingame I couldn't see any noticeable difference between it on or off.

To the idea of keeping console and PC game the same, console has always had restrictions and always will. This kind of game is made to suit PCs not consoles. So personally I find that a bit of poor excuse. There will be plenty of features reduced or dumbed down on console in Fs22, same as Fs19, same as Fs17.
It would be like saying PC can only have the same render distance as console... yet PC Farm Sim is allowed to have everything rendering much further. So therefore they aren't keeping the two games the same.

As to the visual aspect I do strongly disagree... having 45° angles only looks appalling for a game like this now. MTA isn't perfect visually, but in my opinion that is a lot better than having such limited angles.

Personally I feel it's just something that doesn't matter at all so they will just keep ignoring it.

After all that is said, as long as they allow us to mod it into the game still, that is the most important thing.
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this_is_gav
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Re: FS22 Multi Terrain Angle Update?

Post by this_is_gav »

I think The Sim Station says it better than I ever could.

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FarmBoss
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Re: FS22 Multi Terrain Angle Update?

Post by FarmBoss »

b101uk wrote: Fri Jul 23, 2021 5:46 am
FarmBoss wrote: Thu Jul 22, 2021 9:53 pm Maybe the giants devs should watch the tutorial put out by modders, so they can learn how to do it.
But, I think they're busy not completing something else.
it NOT a case of Giants being stupid and unable to do it, it is the fact it take more hardware resources, something that most mod makes don't give a second thought to as to how something will run on minimum spec hardware.

that is besides the aesthetic issues it introduces.
Giants: We won't do it because of the outdated hardware that we still support, and it looks bad.
b101uk: Hook line and sinker.
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b101uk
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Re: FS22 Multi Terrain Angle Update?

Post by b101uk »

FarmBoss wrote: Fri Jul 23, 2021 1:17 pm Giants: We won't do it because of the outdated hardware that we still support, and it looks bad.
b101uk: Hook line and sinker.
says the person who thinks only mod makers have the technical knowhow to do it, which was the erroneous implication of your original post, rather than it being other considerations that many mod makers ignore.

and if we are being honest, there are many situations that having a greater amount of deviations for the texture can also look naff, so in and of itself it too is far from perfect.
plays FS15/FS17/FS19/FS22 on PC
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BulletBill
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Re: FS22 Multi Terrain Angle Update?

Post by BulletBill »

this_is_gav wrote: Fri Jul 23, 2021 12:48 pm I think The Sim Station says it better than I ever could.

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I agree... Daniel is the best...

We should just keep sending this to Stegei until he changes his mind. :lol:
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Stegei
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Re: FS22 Multi Terrain Angle Update?

Post by Stegei »

According to our stats, more than 30% of the PC players play with a PC that is even worse than a PS4/XboxOne. Also the specs of the PS4/XboxOne haven't changed since FS19, so the performance limitations haven't really changed since my last answer to this topic. The same unfortunately applies to the average internet connection.
The problem with multi terrain angle is that it can not be just changed per mp client such as draw distance. If the host has more data, it needs to be sent to the low spec devices too (and processed by them) unless we add some dynamic recompression of that data. Also there is an issue of savegame compatibility. E.g. you always want to be able to switch between a high-end and low-end device and keep the same savegame . We did however make some major changes to our terrain system. So I definitely see a higher chance to be able to change this this time and for FS19. But there are also many other open things to be adressed until the release, so no guarantees at all.
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Re: FS22 Multi Terrain Angle Update?

Post by trogladitez »

BulletBill wrote: Fri Jul 23, 2021 10:01 am I did find it very disappointing that Stefan's answer was the same he gave me over 2 years ago at the beginning of Fs19.

As to the memory performance aspect he would know best on that, but when testing a map in Fs17 with and without MTA via the resource monitor ingame I couldn't see any noticeable difference between it on or off.

To the idea of keeping console and PC game the same, console has always had restrictions and always will. This kind of game is made to suit PCs not consoles. So personally I find that a bit of poor excuse. There will be plenty of features reduced or dumbed down on console in Fs22, same as Fs19, same as Fs17.
It would be like saying PC can only have the same render distance as console... yet PC Farm Sim is allowed to have everything rendering much further. So therefore they aren't keeping the two games the same.

As to the visual aspect I do strongly disagree... having 45° angles only looks appalling for a game like this now. MTA isn't perfect visually, but in my opinion that is a lot better than having such limited angles.

Personally I feel it's just something that doesn't matter at all so they will just keep ignoring it.

After all that is said, as long as they allow us to mod it into the game still, that is the most important thing.
Couldn't agree more. As long as modders like yourself can add it to your maps I really don't care. I don't know how anyone can play the game on console, it looks awful and runs even worse. The first thing I do I'd go into the config file and turn everything up, especially the foliage draw distance.
BulletBill
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Re: FS22 Multi Terrain Angle Update?

Post by BulletBill »

Stegei wrote: Sun Jul 25, 2021 5:06 pm According to our stats, more than 30% of the PC players play with a PC that is even worse than a PS4/XboxOne. Also the specs of the PS4/XboxOne haven't changed since FS19, so the performance limitations haven't really changed since my last answer to this topic. The same unfortunately applies to the average internet connection.
The problem with multi terrain angle is that it can not be just changed per mp client such as draw distance. If the host has more data, it needs to be sent to the low spec devices too (and processed by them) unless we add some dynamic recompression of that data. Also there is an issue of savegame compatibility. E.g. you always want to be able to switch between a high-end and low-end device and keep the same savegame . We did however make some major changes to our terrain system. So I definitely see a higher chance to be able to change this this time and for FS19. But there are also many other open things to be adressed until the release, so no guarantees at all.
Thanks for your answer Stegei... I appreciate it.

I understand you have to balance performance on console versus PC as well keeping game stability. It is just one of those parts of the game that visually just sticks out an awful lot.

I'm assuming that even if you still decide not to implement any form of MTA as default we as modders can still add it in similar to how we did it in Fs19?
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iwan073
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Re: FS22 Multi Terrain Angle Update?

Post by iwan073 »

The game after FS22 won’t have to support the old consoles.
That will open up a lot more possibilities
Ignorance is bliss
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Guil
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Re: FS22 Multi Terrain Angle Update?

Post by Guil »

Current consoles are already old tech. Assuming the next game will be in 3 years time, the console will be 6 years old by the time it releases
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iwan073
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Re: FS22 Multi Terrain Angle Update?

Post by iwan073 »

Yup. Everything you bring out now is old tomorrow night.
Thing is, it’s still more capable than the previous Gen consoles
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Mobias
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Re: FS22 Multi Terrain Angle Update?

Post by Mobias »

Guil wrote: Sun Jul 25, 2021 8:09 pm Current consoles are already old tech. Assuming the next game will be in 3 years time, the console will be 6 years old by the time it releases
The PS5 and Xbox X are both beasts. They're very, very capable machines and still will be in 3 years time. They're incredibly well optimised. Have you seen what Microsoft have done with Flight Simulator 2020? That thing destroys even the highest spec PC and they've managed to get it running smoothly on an Xbox. Its all about optimisation.

And just to add. People here are always fond of weirdly comparing Giants and FS to Rockstar and GTA. GTAVI won't be out for another 3 years either and its being made for the PS5 and Xbox X/S.
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faruk9154
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Re: FS22 Multi Terrain Angle Update?

Post by faruk9154 »

Stegei wrote: Sun Jul 25, 2021 5:06 pm According to our stats, more than 30% of the PC players play with a PC that is even worse than a PS4/XboxOne. Also the specs of the PS4/XboxOne haven't changed since FS19, so the performance limitations haven't really changed since my last answer to this topic. The same unfortunately applies to the average internet connection.
The problem with multi terrain angle is that it can not be just changed per mp client such as draw distance. If the host has more data, it needs to be sent to the low spec devices too (and processed by them) unless we add some dynamic recompression of that data. Also there is an issue of savegame compatibility. E.g. you always want to be able to switch between a high-end and low-end device and keep the same savegame . We did however make some major changes to our terrain system. So I definitely see a higher chance to be able to change this this time and for FS19. But there are also many other open things to be adressed until the release, so no guarantees at all.
Any chance of it coming out with an update later for FS22? :confusednew:
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