Crop germination when soil temp is too low

[IndianaBoy]

So I'm on Ravensberg playing with Seasons (9-day seasons) and using the Sachsen geo. The geo restricts germination to 37F and above.
Also using Precision Farming and Maize Plus (with Forage and Horse Extensions).

I'm on Day 5 (now mid-spring) and the soil temp has not risen above 36F since I started (including 2-3 days of snow!), so I haven't planted anything in my two starting fields.
But I now see that all the surrounding fields have not only been planted, but they are in their first growth state with crops visible.

What is going on?! Is there a problem with the geo not communicating with Seasons on this map?

Thanks to anyone who can help me with this issue.

[DirectCedar]

I'm pretty sure that the fields owned/operated by the AI sort of exist in their own climatic world and are not restricted by the temperature limits of the GEO. At least that has been my observation.

[NDDan]

If you plant a neighbor’s crop as a contract, it will behave according to the geo. If they do it themselves (the game usually updates fields when you fast forward or sleep) it will go straight to the germinated state, regardless of soil temp.

I have found that it is common when starting a new save with seasons that the soil temp will stay the same, or even drop the first few days. This is because the programmed starting soil temp is higher than where it would be based on the climate data. Be patient. It will get there.

[IndianaBoy]

I'm pretty sure that the fields owned/operated by the AI sort of exist in their own climatic world and are not restricted by the temperature limits of the GEO. At least that has been my observation.

Thanks for your thoughts on this. In my first run-through in Ravensberg (aborted due to a different issue) I used a more generic German geo that featured warmer temps. I didn’t see the issue I’m seeing now with the Saxony geo. Weird that the AI fields are not governed by the geo, but oh well…thanks again.

[IndianaBoy]

If you plant a neighbor’s crop as a contract, it will behave according to the geo. If they do it themselves (the game usually updates fields when you fast forward or sleep) it will go straight to the germinated state, regardless of soil temp.

I have found that it is common when starting a new save with seasons that the soil temp will stay the same, or even drop the first few days. This is because the programmed starting soil temp is higher than where it would be based on the climate data. Be patient. It will get there.

Thanks a lot for this explanation. Can you be a bit more specific in defining the “programmed starting soil temp” and how that differs from using the climate data? Where is this starting temp defined - in Seasons or in the geo itself?
And will I see this same phenomenon in the spring of year 2, or does it affect only the starting conditions in year 1?
Thanks again for your help!

[NDDan]

If you plant a neighbor’s crop as a contract, it will behave according to the geo. If they do it themselves (the game usually updates fields when you fast forward or sleep) it will go straight to the germinated state, regardless of soil temp.

I have found that it is common when starting a new save with seasons that the soil temp will stay the same, or even drop the first few days. This is because the programmed starting soil temp is higher than where it would be based on the climate data. Be patient. It will get there.

Thanks a lot for this explanation. Can you be a bit more specific in defining the “programmed starting soil temp” and how that differs from using the climate data? Where is this starting temp defined - in Seasons or in the geo itself?
And will I see this same phenomenon in the spring of year 2, or does it affect only the starting conditions in year 1?
Thanks again for your help!

If you use Seasons without a GEO, the starting soil temp is specified in the Seasons mod as 4.9 celsius. Specific GEOs override this with new data. Assuming you're on PC, you can find this in your mods folder. In the mod folder for your GEO, go to "data>weather.xml." Open it with Notepad or some kind of text editor (not a word processor). The first value set should be the start data. All temps are in celsius. It's possible to unzip a GEO, rename it and edit it to your preferences. Make sure you backup your save before messing with anything. I have carefully done this a few times with no adverse effects. Changing the starting soil temp won't change anything on a current save. Changing the weather data will, eventually. This is probably not the solution you want.

For a quick workaround, you can edit your save file. Your "savegame" folders should be in the same main folder as your mods folder. Again, make a backup. Look for seasons.xml. Open it with a text editor. Your current soil temp is probably on line 8. Again, it's in celsius. If you want to, you can change this value and reload the game. 5 celsius is equal to 41 farenheit. I have not used the Sachsen GEO, so I don't know what it's like. Some GEOs change the germination temps for crops. You probably know your target temperature from the in game seasons menu.

What I mean by "climate data" is that the Seasons mod uses the recent weather history from your savegame to calculate the environment (current soil temp, crop moisture, ground moisture). So the starting soil temp only applies to year 1, day 1. You should not have this problem in year 2. However, germination might be late, just based on the weather.

Or, if you just want to see what will happen, copy your savegame folder and rename it to an empty slot, like "savegame20." Open that save in the game, advance a few days, and see what happens. Then go back and play your real save. My guess is that nothing is broken, and you just have to wait for the soil temp to go up. It's like real farming. You're at the mercy of the weather. That's part of what makes Seasons fun.

[IndianaBoy]

Super helpful information, NDDan! Really appreciate it...I'll start digging into the xml files later today. I actually build simulation models for a living(!), so I'm pretty familiar with this process.

Many thanks for providing the details of how Seasons is working. I totally get being "at the mercy of the weather" -- that's exactly what I want so that I can add a little dose of extra realism to the simulation.
But the real issue I see in my game is that the surrounding fields that are controlled by the AI are apparently NOT governed by the same rules that I am...while the soil temp is still too cold for me to see successful germination, all the other fields around me are growing. That's the part I can't explain.
DirectCedar above says that the AI-controlled fields are not bound by the same rules as the player on this -- which may be true, but seems really weird to me. Does that also make sense to you?

Thanks so much once again for your thoughtful reply!

[NDDan]

Super helpful information, NDDan! Really appreciate it...I'll start digging into the xml files later today. I actually build simulation models for a living(!), so I'm pretty familiar with this process.

Many thanks for providing the details of how Seasons is working. I totally get being "at the mercy of the weather" -- that's exactly what I want so that I can add a little dose of extra realism to the simulation.
But the real issue I see in my game is that the surrounding fields that are controlled by the AI are apparently NOT governed by the same rules that I am...while the soil temp is still too cold for me to see successful germination, all the other fields around me are growing. That's the part I can't explain.
DirectCedar above says that the AI-controlled fields are not bound by the same rules as the player on this -- which may be true, but seems really weird to me. Does that also make sense to you?

Thanks so much once again for your thoughtful reply!

You're welcome. And yes. I completely agree with DirectCedar. It's weird, but that's just how the program functions. They apparently get planted and immediately germinate whenever the Seasons calendar says they can, regardless of conditions. You will notice in the fall that they get harvested even if it's too wet for you to harvest.

[IndianaBoy]

Super helpful information, NDDan! Really appreciate it...I'll start digging into the xml files later today. I actually build simulation models for a living(!), so I'm pretty familiar with this process.

Many thanks for providing the details of how Seasons is working. I totally get being "at the mercy of the weather" -- that's exactly what I want so that I can add a little dose of extra realism to the simulation.
But the real issue I see in my game is that the surrounding fields that are controlled by the AI are apparently NOT governed by the same rules that I am...while the soil temp is still too cold for me to see successful germination, all the other fields around me are growing. That's the part I can't explain.
DirectCedar above says that the AI-controlled fields are not bound by the same rules as the player on this -- which may be true, but seems really weird to me. Does that also make sense to you?

Thanks so much once again for your thoughtful reply!

You're welcome. And yes. I completely agree with DirectCedar. It's weird, but that's just how the program functions. They apparently get planted and immediately germinate whenever the Seasons calendar says they can, regardless of conditions. You will notice in the fall that they get harvested even if it's too wet for you to harvest.

Thanks again. Yeah, seems like proper planting rules for AI fields is something that could be implemented...maybe in fs22, but I still have a lot of time I want to put into fs19!