Would Article 13 change things?

[Questionnaire]

For those who don't know the EU is planning to enact new regulations that limit the replication of "personal" data without consent since mods are "personal" files; does that mean that mod sites will die? The reason I ask is that the websites used to be intermediaries, but in theory, they will be responsible for all the mods posted on them. Since GIANTS is in the EU how would this change the modhub if at all? I would think the modders give you permission to publish their mod, correct? Would the original modder have to give permission for each repost on every site? How would they (site owners) know if they got permission?

[eric21]

I thought it only implied streams?

[Questionnaire]

I'm pretty sure it is anything posted on public websites

[Beastbubba]

I'm pretty sure the EU is tyrannical... so glad I don't live there...

A13 is a nighmare.

[BullFarmer]

By posting something on a public website I assume you give consent for anyone else to use it?

[Faelandaea]

Since GIANTS is in the EU how would this change the modhub if at all?

No they would not have to change anything, because the only ones who upload to the actual in-game mod hub have to be the original authors. Third party posts to the official FS Mod Hub of mods are generally rejected. Some might slip through, but it is highly looked down upon.

does that mean that mod sites will die?

As long as we have Thomas on modhub.us, we'll always have access to mods ROFL.

Okay, seriously, though, we will not have to worry. The EU might try to enforce stuff locally in the EU, but trying to enforce it globally is almost impossible. It's the internet, so as long as there exists people wanting mods, and people making mods, we will always have mods.

I would think the modders give you permission to publish their mod, correct? Would the original modder have to give permission for each repost on every site? How would they (site owners) know if they got permission?

Now for the part that makes people hate me a lot around the net ... if a modder uploads something to the net, they DO give the public permission to use their mod and to do with it whatever they want. It makes me laugh when a mod author says "not allowed to upload elsewhere" ... that's like saying "not allowed to let people find stuff they want to use." I jokingly mentioned Thomas above, but that guy uploading to modhub.us is the reason why I have discovered 99% of the mods I use. I actually have a life and a career. i don;t have time to be trolling through FaceBook, Twitter, forums, and obscure web sites that do not even appear on Google to find a mod I like. So if someone uploads a mod from somewhere else I can use, I am going to use it ... period ... end of story.

If a mod author REALLY does not want his work being used by people, he needs to keep it off the net. Simple as that.

I made the original signs for ATS for a real company mod right after it released. Immediately after I uploaded the project, my signs appeared in a LOT of mods ... without me telling them they can ... and without any of them giving due credit to me. I could spend hours moaning and complaining about my signs being used "without permission" or some stuff like that, but instead it brought a SMILE to my face that well known mod authors were using MY work to drive their success. The end user may not know they are using my work, but I know ... and that is enough for me. By uploading those signs in the first place, I knew everyone out there would snag them and use them. Uploading = permission, and that is final.

[Questionnaire]

Ok, all makes sense but what if it was "stolen" AKA. posted without the owner's consent?

[Beastbubba]

No one owns a mod after it's been released. You cain't steal a mod unless you break into someone's house and take it of their pc... The people who try to hide their mods behind a pay wall are just sol if someone post it on a free site. Dosen't matter what kinda disclaimer they have to get to the mod, after someone has it they can distribute it to anyone they want, they can even proclaim they did it. The most the modder could do is stop their access to the pay wall...

And as Faelandaea said, the EU can pass w/e laws they want. They cain't enforce anything outside their borders. And all you need is a vpn to access sites outside of your country...

[Faelandaea]

Exactly what BeastBubba said.

By uploading a mod to the internet, the author already HAS given COMPLETE consent to do with the mod whatever anyone wants. It's the same concept as sending embarrassing nude photos of oneself ... if you don;t want it available for the world to see, don't do it for anyone at all.

Mod authors know their options. There are only two options. For me, I keep my mods private. In my entire time modding, I have released I think 3 mods publicly. I understood when I released those that I was giving consent for folks to take them, reupload them, and pretend THEY were the author. Fortunately they were mods that were so stupidly simple that even my ex wife could have probably done them if she had a brain (a big "if" there.) My good mods I keep to myself ... not because I want to be selfish ... but because I want my game and my live stream to have a bit of individuality and uniqueness in my gameplay But as a mod author, I understand that if I do upload something publicly, I have NO right at all to complain if someone uses the stuff I upload. Internet = public domain.

So, yeah, you can NOT "steal" a mod off the internet.

[Showdizzle]

The entirety of this argument comes down to burden of proof claim on ownership of the intellectual property. Following that is the petitioner financially prepared to litigate a claim resulting in minimal returns after fees. The answers would resounding be no in the majority of cases over a mod in my opinion. However, attorneys are like Giants and will take your money for little effort so forge ahead.

[Rickenbacker]

By posting something on a public website I assume you give consent for anyone else to use it?

You really don't, but on the internet no-one cares about copyright anyway .

[Rickenbacker]

Exactly what BeastBubba said.

By uploading a mod to the internet, the author already HAS given COMPLETE consent to do with the mod whatever anyone wants. It's the same concept as sending embarrassing nude photos of oneself ... if you don;t want it available for the world to see, don't do it for anyone at all.

Mod authors know their options. There are only two options. For me, I keep my mods private. In my entire time modding, I have released I think 3 mods publicly. I understood when I released those that I was giving consent for folks to take them, reupload them, and pretend THEY were the author. Fortunately they were mods that were so stupidly simple that even my ex wife could have probably done them if she had a brain (a big "if" there.) My good mods I keep to myself ... not because I want to be selfish ... but because I want my game and my live stream to have a bit of individuality and uniqueness in my gameplay But as a mod author, I understand that if I do upload something publicly, I have NO right at all to complain if someone uses the stuff I upload. Internet = public domain.

So, yeah, you can NOT "steal" a mod off the internet.

That's not how copyright law works. I mean, I know that's how it works in practice, because no-one gives a **** about copyright, but you can very much steal a mod, and in theory be charged if you republish it without permission.

[Questionnaire]

I am playing devil's advocate, but if the internet worked liked that; when you upload videos to youtube or type up an article for a news platform/blog or any scholarly journal is it not yours anymore? Does it belong to everyone or do people still have to site you? Is it different for mods because wth modsites people don't care about rules or do the rules still apply?

[Beastbubba]

Fair use is still part of it. If someone takes it and modifies it it is different. Also its a different issue due to Giants editor. Technically all content made with it belongs partly to Giants. And when people want to sell mods they should have to pay Giants royalties, which they don't do... The straw mod was an example of this in proper action.

[Farmer_Mike]

By uploading a mod to the internet, the author already HAS given COMPLETE consent to do with the mod whatever anyone wants.
So, yeah, you can NOT "steal" a mod off the internet.

No one owns a mod after it's been released. You cain't steal a mod unless you break into someone's house and take it of their pc.

OK so you two are completely wrong. I suggest you do some research before you make statements like this to suit yourselves!

I have been playing LS for almost 9 years now and it is because of people like you we have seen a decline in great modders and mods.
There are still some honest great modders but most are not and just steal or convert others works without asking.


By supporting bad mod sites like you do you are disrespecting legitimate modders. If they upload a mod to the Giants modHub then that is where it belongs. This way the mod author can patch it as needed and also be rewarded by Giants for their time and effort, thus helping pay for the costs associated with modding and their time. If you go to the bad sites and download then the only person being rewarded is someone that did nothing.

This also includes mods uploaded on private sites, facebook and forums. Using pay per download sites to host work is wrong by modders and against T&C of Giants but this means you just do not use this mod, not re-upload it. Mods on forums are sometimes used to attract new members to join up to download it, nothing wrong here and if you do not want to join then do not use the mod and move on. But if you do like it the join up and if you find an error tell them their and contribute and thank them so they do more things you like.



edit: The following information is for everyone and I am not targeting anyone unless they have made a statement that shows this is how the feel. I have added this note due to confusion.

1. You or anyone cannot and should not take a mod and redistribute it.

2. You or anyone cannot and should not take a mod and edit it unless it is for private use. This includes scripts (These are even more protected as imposing copyright is easier here).

Now I will give you the supporting documents to back up my claims. Something you did not and cannot do, as their is none to support your claims!

1)

All user generated contents on ModHub are properties of their respective creators. We are not responsible for these user generated contents or any damage they may cause to your game. If you think your user generated content or parts of it are on ModHub without your consent, please contact us. abuse@giants-software.com

2)
' https://www.farming-simulator.com/term ... ions.php? ' Section 7 of the T&C (7.1 & 7.2)

7 Transfer of usage rights to the Customer’s User Generated Content

7.1 If the Customer creates User Generated Content for the games, he retains the rights to the content that he has generated. The Customer grants GIANTS the right to use the User Generated Content created by the Customer. ---- "This says Giants not everyone. I know a lot of people like to try and twist this one but it is in black and white."

7.2 The Customer warrants that, at the time of the creation, use or distribution of the Mods, he is the holder of the usage rights to the User Generated Content created by the Customer. Furthermore, the Customer warrants that the User Generated Content created by the Customer does not infringe any copyright or other third-party rights. ---- "This is especially important for people who like to edit and release scripts"

3)
Discord post by a Giants employee.


And the final reason I am going to list (I could go on all day).
Because the right thing to do is ask as a decent human. You are not entitled to any mod, you are just lucky to be offered it.
If they say no or you can not find them then just move on and make a new one or use something else you are allowed to.

I am sure some people will argue with me but that is just so they feel OK about what they do. Anyone with a shred of decency to other human beings or had actually spent hundreds of hours doing a mod correctly from nothing or thought up and wrote a script from nothing then you will always ask.

If all these bad converts and thefts did not happen then maybe we would not still have LS13 mods entering the game in 19 without any texture upgrades.

I am not a modder, I am a middle aged man who respects modders and ALL HUMAN PEOPLES rights to be shown respect. Where do you stand?

Mike